Date: Tue, 02 Jan 1996
From: Mary Margaret Palmer
Subject: Re: Dialogue
From: Richard Scott <scott@cats.ucsc.edu>
My company has been using the dialogoue process in a leadership training
for a major telecommunications company for the past two years with
execellent results.
The training is a four day program of which one day is devoted to what we
refer to as the dialogue/discussion process in the context of real time
issues facing the company and the training participants. We find a good
mixture of experiential problem-solving activities, real time issues, and
dialogue/discussion processes make for a very successful training.
------------------------------------------------
From: Dutch Driver <bnd6880@tam2000.tamu.edu>
| AUTHOR: Bohm, David.
| TITLE: On dialogue /
| PLACE: Ojai, CA :
| PUBLISHER: David Bohm Seminars,
| YEAR: 1990
| PUB TYPE: Book
| FORMAT: 41 p. ; 22 cm.
| NOTES: "...edited from the transcription of a meeting...November 6,
| 1989, in Ojai, California, following a weekend seminar given by
| Professor Bohm. Additional material on dialogue has been taken
| from other of Dr. Bohm's seminars. The final manuscript was
| edited by Dr. Bohm."
| "Transcription and editing: Phildea Fleming, James Brodsky."
| SUBJECT: Dialogue analysis.
| Dialogue.
----------------------------------------------
From: Orbis <74363.3637@compuserve.com>
Here is a good article:
Taking flight: Dialogue, collective thinking, and
organizational learning
Authors: Isaacs, William N
Journal: Organizational Dynamics (ORD) ISSN: 0090-2616
Vol: 22 Iss: 2 Date: Autumn 1993 p: 24-39
Abstract: Experience with the discipline of dialogue suggests that there
is a new horizon opening up for the field of management and organizational
learning. Dialogue can be initially defined as a sustained collective
inquiry into the processes, assumptions, and certainties that compose
everyday experience. Dialogue is an advance on double-loop learning
processes and represents triple-loop learning. This field suggests a new
range of skills for managers that involve learning how to set up
environments or fields in which learning can take place. This discipline
stresses the power of collective observation of patterns of collective
thought that typically speed by people or influence their behavior without
them noticing.
Dialogue is an emerging and potentially powerful mode of inquiry and
collective learning for teams. It balances more structured problem-solving
approaches with the exploration of fundamental habits of attention and
assumption behind traditional problems of thinking.
Also, there are dialogue references in "The Fifth Discipline Fieldbook,"
(Currency Doubleday) and "Mr. Learning Organization," Fortune 10/17/94.
A consulting org. that trains folks in dialogue is:
Action Design in Newton Mass.
The folks there are all "disciples" of Chris Argyris, whose writing covers
dialogue-type stuff, but he does not use that name.
------------------------------------------------
From: Lansing Bicknell <bicknell>
I particpated in the begining's of the Dialogue project via MIT back in
'91-92. I believe the Dialogue Project has become it's own entity,
focusing on developing and extending Bohm's original model of dialogue.
I am sure Pegasus communications can put you in touch with the Dialogue
Project directly. However, another good source book to read by David Bohm
and Mark Edwards is called "Changing Consciousness: Exploring the Hidden
Source of Social, Political and Environmental Crises Facing our Wrorld",
Harper Collins, San Francisco, 1991. This book is a dialogue between Bohm
and Edwards (a social photographer whose work is part of the book) about
the nature of thought and the role fragmented thinking has in creating the
world we live in today. The last chapter is especially powerful. Another
article that's good is "The Emergence of Learning Communities", by
Stephanie Spear from The Systems Thinker, Pegasus Communications, Vol. 4,
No. 5, 1993. You Can reach Pegasus at 617-576-1231. This is article that
points to the role dialogue can have in the process of creating or building
community (Community a la M. Scott Peck's "The Different Drum: Community
Making and Peace"). I have some more things to say from my experience of
working with the Dialogue project a few years ago and how I've integrated
that experience into my practice as a facilitator and a consultant. I'd be
happy to share this with anyone who is interested directly via e-mail or
you can call me at 512-918-8000.
--------------------------------------------------
From: Dmweston@aol.com
I spotted your request for info on Dialogue and thought I'd pass along a list
of references put together by one of my friends and former associate, Richard
Burg. Richard sent this list to the LO List a few months ago, and it's a good
one for materials on Dialogue by Bohm. (He may have sent you this list as
well if he caught your message!)
Richard describes Bohmian dialogue briefly as "non-contingent" on a subject
or agenda. The dialogue practiced by Bill Isaacs and associates in The
Dialogue Project at MIT and his company, Dialogos, is a slightly different
take--we think of it as "strategic dialogue," where there is a more specific
arena for the conversation (a topic or issue of business concern) and the
group learns techniques for building trust, allowing open expression, and
making inquiries to explore each others' thinking and assumptions. We use
many of the techniques described by Chris Argyris (the Fifth Discipline
Fieldbook introduces them pretty well).
A good set of articles on OL and dialogue were presented in the Winter 1993
issue of Organizational Dynamics (a quarterly from the American Mgmt Assoc.),
with ones by Bill Isaacs and Edgar Schein on dialogue, and an excellent
article on community by Peter Senge and Fred Kofman. For more on Argyris, see
his Harvard Business Review articles from July/Aug 1994 and May/June 1991.
As for trainers in dialogue, Dialogos offers several courses on dialogue for
various audiences. The "Foundations for Dialogue" and "Practitioner
Development Program" are delivered on a public basis or to private groups in
companies. Dialogos has worked with numerous corporate, educational, and
government organizations to develop the learning and structures for on-going
dialogue. Let me know if you would like some further information, or you may
contact Dialogos' headquarters at 617/576-7986, P.O.Box 1149, Cambridge, MA
02142-0009.
-------------------------------------------
From Richard Burg, Meridian Group, Berkeley, CA:
As I understand the evolution, both Bill Isaacs and Peter Senge were both
inspired to create a dialogue practise in support of the Learning
Organization through their experience with David Bohm. I have an online
copy of "Dialogue: A Proposal" by David Bohm, Donald Factor, and Peter
Garrett. I transcribed this from paper. If you are interested in it,
please e-mail me directly. I will ask about permission to distribute it
electronically.
Art Kleiner referenced the booklet _On Dialogue_. It was published in
Ojai, California by David Bohm Seminars, P.O. Box 1452, 93023. Routledge,
a publisher in NY, is planning to republish it, with additional material,
including an extenive 'map' to the history of David's investigations that
led to Dialogue. Bohm's work with Dialogue was in a form that is sometimes
referred to as "non-contingent" - he saw the process as one convened
without a purpose, beyond examining "thought" arising in a group of 20 to
40 people.
A series of talks which David gave in Ojai has been transcribed and
published by Routledge as _Thought as a System_. It is available in
bookstores in the UK and the US now.
[Host's Note: ISBN 0-415-11980 hbk, ISBN 0-415-11030 paperbk]
The use of Dialogue in organizations is a variation and departure from
Bohm's intention. Bohm sought to challenge the epistemology of our
relationship to the world. His suggestion was that the 'solutions' to
problems in the world are as much artifacts of the source of the
'problems', as the 'problems' themselves. Until we can stop and look at
thought, we can not halt the ongoing introduction of actions which failed
to see the whole. His proposal draws heavily, but indirectly, on his work
as a quantum physicist, the work of an English psychoanalyst, Patrick
deMare, author of _Koinonia_ and a long and deep relationship with the
educator, J. Krishnamurti.
I have attached a casual bibliography of references on Dialogue prepared
for a 1993 National OD Network Pre-conference Workshop. A group which has
been engaged in the experiment proposed by Bohm for nearly five years
invited conferees to join them in a weekend of dialogue. And A. Kleiner
mentioned that the Fieldbook has material on Dialogue.
A Casual Bibliography
Referencing David Bohm and Dialogue
_Wholeness and the Implicate Order_, David Bohm, New York: Arc Paperbacks,
1983.
_Unfolding Meaning: A Weekend of Dialogue with David Bohm_, David Bohm,
New York: Arc Paperbacks, 1987.
_The Ending of Time_, David Bohm and J. Krishnamurti, San Francisco:
Harper and Row, 1985.
_Science, Order, and Creativity_, David Bohm and F. David Peat, New York:
Bantam, 1987.
_Changing Consciousness_, David Bohm and Mark Edwards, San Franscisco:
HarperSanFrancisco, 1991.
_On Dialogue_, David Bohm, from David Bohm Seminars, P.O. Box 1452, Ojai,
CA 93023.
_The Fifth Discipline_, Peter Senge, New York: Doubleday, 1990.
_Fifth Generation Management_, Charles M. Savage, Maynard, MA: Digital
Press, 1990.
_Stewardship: Choosing Service Over Self-Interest_, Peter Block, San
Francisco: Barrett-Koehler, 1993.
_Koinonia: From Hate, through Dialogue, to Culture in the Large Group_,
Patrick de Mare', New York: Karnac Books, 1991.
"Dialogue: The Power of Collective Thinking", William Isaac, The System
Thinker, V.4, No.3, Cambridge: Pegasus Communications, 1993.
-----------------------------------------
From: Tony Page <tonypage@dircon.co.uk>
I am also interested in dialogue. I have in front of me a booklet
entitled "On Dialogue - David Bohm". It is an edited transcript of a
meeting in Ojai California in 1989 follwing a weekend seminar by David
Bohm. Available from Pegasus, Cambridge, MA, phone 617-576-1231, fax
617-576-3114.
The Fifth Discipline Fieldbook by Peter Senge, 1994 et al ISBN
1-85788-060-9 has a whole section entitled Designing a Dialogue session.
It draws information from the Dialogue project run by Bill Isaacs at the
Center for Organisational Learning at MIT.
I have recently been a participant in a dialogue group cmprised of HR/OD
types people in a pharmaceutical company. It is early days but I would
be happy to share how it develops at time passes.
--------------------------------------------
From: NAME: Scott L. Lewis
Bohm's Dialogue Process is discussed extensively in Peter
Senghe's book, _The Fifth Discipline_. The book also has a lot
of references into David Bohm's works. I would also look at _The
Fifth Discipline Field Book_. I've only perused that one, but
from the looks of it, it amplifies each topic covered in _The
Fifth Discipline_.
----------------------------------------------------
From: CENTERZU@aol.com
I've worked with various dialogue processes for several years.
I find it is necessary to "customize" the dialogue process depending on the
group and the purpose. It is useful to help people recognize the essential
difference between discussion (same root word as percussion and concussion)
and a truly free flow of ideas to help a group discover new meaning.
SAMulgrew@AOL.com has developed some practical guidelines recently for a
business client and she may be willing to share if you e-mail a request.
In my experience, it is necessary to introduce dialogue in different ways and
emphasize different aspects of the process depending on the group you are
working with. With my business clients, the process needs to be streamlined
and introduced in a way that emphasizes the practical applications. With my
research astrophysicists, the niceties of the process are more relevant,
however it is necessary to include some articulate non-scientists in order to
help people think "out of the box" enough to allow for possible new meanings
to emerge. With government folks it is often necessary to adapt the
process to help move people off rhetorical ground.
As with most processes, success depends, in my opinion, on adaptation to the
context. I might be able to be more helpful if I knew your intended purpose.
New Paradigms for Learning (New_Paradigms@aol.com) based in Berkeley, CA has
done quite of bit of this kind of work also. Dr. Barbara Pennington there may
be willing to offer some references and suggestions.
-----------------------------------------------------
From: "Robert Levi" <rlevi@usa.net>
In response to Mary Margaret Palmer's request for information on the
Dialogue Process, I offer the following brief summary of Dialogue. I use
this in gatherings with folks who don't know a lot about the process:
Also, see a paper I posted, edited by Richard Burg (are you out there,
Richard?) from a talk given by Bohm, et al, on his version of Dialogue.
NOTE: This paper is NOT included in this compilation as it is VERY LONG
and I have already posted it once to the newsgroup. If you want a copy of
it please email me at fearless@roadrunner.com Thanks MM
ELEMENTS OF DIALOGUE
Definition:
An intentional and sustained inquiry into the assumptions, certainties, and
processes that structure common experience and inform collective action.
Dialogue begins with the premise that there is an implicate undivided
wholeness that can be made explicate. It consists of a flow of meaning that
requires a shared "field" of experience and attention.
Dialogue Requires Shifts From:
Knower to Learner
Competence to Vulnerability
Arrogance to Humility
Observer to Participant
Qualities of Dialogue:
Suspension
----------
Suspension involves putting an idea, feeling, or belief into the middle, and
taking one's hand off of it, so what gets put in the middle becomes the
property of the whole. You, as well as the group, can look at what's there
from many different angles. The investment is withdrawn and up for inquiry.
Inquiry
-------
The spirit of inquiry involves an open space in which to ask questions about
where a particular assertion, belief, or idea came from. Much of what arises
in a conversation is based on assumptions we make, and there is often a need
to question the data that led us to think a certain way. In a dialogue, a
person who is making broad generalizations can be subject to inquiry. How
did you get there? Can you give me the data that supports your conclusions?
There is a greater possibility for deeper understanding with the inquiry
process. Inquiry must be balanced with advocacy if there is to be Dialogue.
Generative listening
--------------------
Generative listening is essential in dialogue, and involves letting go of
"building my case" when someone is speaking from a different point of view.
It involves "listening for understanding," rather than preparing to convince
the other person that they are wrong.
Holding tension of opposites
----------------------------
Holding a space that has polarity and opposites is also an essential quality
of dialogue that addresses the wide variation in views usually present in a
diverse group. There is a need to have a container built that respects the
differences and enjoys and cultivates the energies between the diverse
elements.
Ladder of Inference
--------------------
/----/ I take ACTIONS based on my beliefs.
/----/ I adopt BELIEFS about the world. -----------------| My BELIEFS
/----/ I draw CONCLUSIONS. | affect the
/----/ I make ASSUMPTIONS based on the meanings I added | DATA that
/----/ I add MEANINGS (cultural and personal). | select.>
/----/ I select "DATA" from what I observe. <------------|
/----/ All the information in the world
We use this tool a lot to examine beliefs that are advocated by folks. If
you take the time to "walk" down the ladder of inference, there is a lot of
learning to be had, especially around the "MEANINGS" rung. Also, the
"reflexive loop" is another big learning piece...that our beliefs affect the
data we select (usually to reinforce our beliefs.) This has large
implications on the scientific method.
(Many thanks to Dr. William Isaacs for his excellent research into the
Dialogue process. His institute, Dialogos, puts on excellent trainings in
Dialogue. Dialogos can be reached at 617-576-7986. Tell them you heard about
them from Robert Levi on the Internet.)
There is a lot more I could write about, but I think I've done enough
"advocating". I look forward to any "inquiries" about the process.
----------------------------------------------
From: bgirard@Dialup.FranceNet.fr (Bernard Girard)
Those interested in dialogue might read Martin Buber who published several
texts on this topic. He wrote in german. I know there was a french
traduction of these texts in the late fifties. There must have been an
english traduction. Buber was a jewish philosopher, he lived his last
years in Jerusalem.
---------------------------------------------
From: "david.r.dobat" <david.r.dobat@aa.compuserve.com>
In your post you asked for reference materials on dialogue. The only one
I can think of off the top of my head is On Dialogue by David Bohm. I
think that this text is actually a transcribed and edited conversation
from a talk he gave on the subject.
In most of my conversations I try to carry the "spirit" of dialogue to the
table (or circle as the case may be). That is to say I try to focus on my
own presence, deep listening to the group, listening to myself and
listening to the silence. I try to be aware of my own listening and how
it might be impacting the conversation. I try to suspend my own
judgements and make my reasoning explicit for others to explore. All of
this is very hard to do. I would like to think that by being aware of
these things in conversation, the conversation itself is changed in some
subtle way. I would also like to think that this serves as an invitation
for others to become aware of their own listening, reasoning, etc.
Introducing dialogue and all of its concepts may be more confusing at
first. People are always curious about a conversation whose purpose is to
allow meaning to emerge from the group. Do we have time for that? What
does it look like? Do we have it down yet? These are some of the
questions I have received after introducing the concept (which may be a
sign that I can't introduce dialogue very effectively).
I would suggest that you try different things with different groups and
see which is more effective for you. I have found it helpful to carry
within me the spirit of dialogue and try to explain the concepts later.
In other words, try to model the behavior then after a few conversations
make it explicit. This also allows the space for others to give you
feedback on how "dialogue-like" your own conversations are.
-------------------------------------------------
From: JimGilmore@aol.com
I would share the "four criteria" of dialogue as outlined in Don Peppers and
Martha Rogers' book, __The One to One Future__ (Currency Doubleday, 1993.)
1. All parties to a dialogue must be able to participate in it.
2. All parties to a dialogue must want to participate in it.
3. Dialogues can be controlled by anyone in the exchange
4. Your dialogue with an individual customer will change your behavior toward
that single individual, and change that individual's behavior toward you.
-------------------------------------------------------
From: Jvandeusen@aol.com
Responding to your inquiry re: dialogue process. Major references worth
looking at in addition to Bohm's books are Peter Senge's Fifth Discipline and
Fifth Discipline Reader (both published by Doubleday), and Marvin Weisbor'd
Discovering Common Ground and Future Search (both published by
Berrett-Koehler). I also posted a message on this to the Learning Org List,
mentioning Patrick de Mare and Krishnamurti as Bohm's primary sources.
--------------------------------------------------------
Try checking with:
David Bohm Seminars Committee
Attn:Meredy & John Maynard
P.O. Box 1452, Ojai, CA 93024-1452
805) 646-9357